FEATURED IN FEBRUARY 2009
Matt’s provided us with a couple of projects completed by Edmund Angelus Automotive. If you are near Roanoke, Virginia and are looking for someone to handle your rebuilds, you might consider them as they have rebuilt a couple of beauties. Thanks for sharing Matt! You can contact Matt at 540-354-4321.
Matt writes: “Welcome to Edmund Angelus Automotive. Located at the foot of Bent Mountain in Roanoke Virginia. I do restorations and all kinds of custom work,heck I will paint a refridgerator if pays my rate of $38.00hr. The yellow jeep is a restoration w/a body kit installed. The Green CJ-3a is the second for the same customer, it also is a off-frame restoration with the original and complete make over with nearly 900hrs, the christmas jeep as it is called by the customers two little twin boys. These are taking an average of 18 to 20 weeks to do. I am currently doing B.J.#102, It is ’46 Willys Boyer Fire Jeep w/out the fire equipment. It found its way to me in literaly pieces and in lots of boxes. Now in week 19 I am acctually able to get in it fire it up and take it around the patch.”
Here’s a variety of pics related to these builds:
Matt, help us out …. 900 hrs x $38.00/hr = $34,200 labor + parts for the green 3A — so round numbers the full restoration cost about $40,000, right? And that would be typical of what someone could expect to spend if they brought you a Jeep today? Thanks for your kind attention and assistance.
Jim here, Ive known Matt for a couple years, he’s a straight up guy, extremely talented and I consider him to be a close friend. Matt has a very special clientele, they can afford the very, very best. He’s booked for the next couple years and his work is hands down better than factory, museum quality, every single parts is better than new when he’s done. For all you nonbelievers out there thinking you cant get $25K+ for a Willys restoration, Matt is living proof that there are people out there willing to pay the price and what they get in return is downright amazing, in a class by itself. through very hard work and a relentless pursuits of perfection, Matt has created a niche that guarantees his restorations will quite literally last forever in classic car collections all over the world.
Ed, thanks for the question. $41,000. would be closer to the mark; it seems crazy I know. Is this typical for a cj? No, each is different. Depending on what kind of shape the vehicle is in and what the scope of work is to be. For example, restoring the original sheet metal to its former shape in most cases, is going to be more costly than a complete body kit install. Simply due to the amount of labor. Keep in mind the green cj-3a was an original farm jeep. Used as such, and the number of repairs documented daily with digital pictures filled a four disc set. In essence Ed it all depends on what the customer is looking for. For the do it your selfers, I will do just the body tub sheet matal and send it crated back to them completed to their specified details. Something to always remember about restorations is this, they in most cases will cost more than the the book or stated value the vehicle. – Matt
Hi Matt,
Thanks for that update. It’s certainly information you don’t have to disclose, but it does provide a unique look at the differing budgets people have for their projects.
– Dave
Yup, restoring one, esp. paying someone to do it, is always more expensive than buying one already done. I say if you have the money and the desire to do it, why not? I personally don’t have that kind of money, so I do everything myself, which intersects well with my love of doing things myself.
Looks like nice work. Matt, what is the purple primer?
I have done a few restorations for people as well, I have done 2 MB’s and a GPW. Ive found that on average it only takes around 200hrs to do one (Depending on bodywork) Not sure what goes into a CJ though, The MB’s are really simple to do.
Erik,
No way a complete MB rebuild can be done in 5 weeks by one person!
You may be able to get a lot done but I am doubting how well the unit will turn out if one man spends 5 weeks on it. Most of the time you don’t even know the each entire part you are goine to need till you get 2-3 weeks in. They you have the time involved on the motor rebuild, generator, startor, distributor rebuilds etc. Guages redone….. the list goes on and on. I guess if you had all new parts in hand and ready to go you may be able to turn something out in a couple of months. ” Ive found that on average it only takes around 200hrs to do one (Depending on bodywork)” That means that some of the units you did took less then 200 hours since 200 was the average! Your not working on the same level as Matt is here buddy. Sorry to be so cold, but I just don’t see you doing this.
What im talking about is straight working hours, I Dont count painting and such when say this. I Wasnt putting Matt down, His work looks spectacular. What i was saying is that my experience with rebuilds has taken less than 900hrs, Your right, I dont tend to rebuild the guages and things like that and i outsource the electrical work to other shops. I also have others who help with the rebuilds, I should have stated that in my previous comment. For me, teardown of a jeep takes around 10-11 hrs, I then send out the frame and body to be sandblasted while i work on the engine (If i dont have to rebore the cylenders this takes around 20-30 hrs) I send out the transmission to be done as i cannot do them ( ive tried, didnt work) Once i get the frame back i make any repairs needed to it (typically 12 hrs work) and clean and fix up the axles and steering components. Then i paint and spend around 100hrs to rebuild it.
I doubt im on the same level as Matt, Im only 19 and dont have the skills or resources to do everything on my own. but i have done it…3 times over. and i have gotten many complements for my work.
There’s a major difference between a Restoration where the vehicle is brought back to new condition and a Krylon overhaul where major parts are repainted but nothing is rebuilt. Whatever quality you choose for your vehicle it should be dependable and safe.
“I doubt im on the same level as Matt, Im only 19”
Why didn’t I think about this before?!
It all makes sense now, I am trying to argue reality with a teenager!
I don’t think I will say anymore know that I know what I am deeling with.
Thanks for the comments guys.
Dave: Thanks for helping clarify Erik’s position on this.
Erik, the fact that you have already rebuilt three jeeps at age 19 is a credit to you. As this discussion thread highlights, defining the term ‘rebuilt’ is difficult, because rebuilt is a subjective term (as the works of many ‘rebuilt’ jeeps on this site that are for sale underscore). Personally, what I’d like to see you do, is push yourself so that your next rebuild is as high quality as Matt’s. Make sure to count everyone hour, including the many hours of research necessary to restore a vehicle to an original state. I think you’ll discover that improving the quality just 5% increases the time demands far beyond just increasing your hours by 5%.
More importantly, the experience you’ll gain trying to perfect your next rebuild will benefit you beyond rebuilding a simple jeep.
Let me know how that goes.
Thanks,
– David Eilers
Dave: obviously you have had some bad experiences with teenagers. Im sorry about that, but please dont lump all of us into a single basket. It is difficult to put your words into a comment section like this and comments such as that dont help.
Mr. Eilers: Thank you for the comment, I doubt i will ever get to the point that Matt is at without building myself my own buisness. I do not do show quality builds, My aim is for the Reenactor market. Building a jeep that you can use and not be too worried about beating it up a little. When i did my first jeep (Mine) I spent many months just researching what would go into it using Military manuals, TO&E’s and Internet to find out exactly what paint color, stencil types and sizes and equipment would be allotted to a military jeep. I am an avid historian and take pride in the amount i know about the vehicle.
I am currently working on my 3rd rebuild (Frame up) and am just starting to get a hang of counting hours. I take great pleasure in my work and the result that i get. Unlike Matt i dont charge for my work, This is the first project that i have been offered money to do it.
Im sorry for any hostilities my comments created. In my comment i meant to ask what goes into a CJ to take so many hours.
Cheers
Erik Hersche
Erik,
I hesitated to continue on with the discussion here. But the other Dave made some really good points to you that I wanted to commend him for. He took a much higher road then I on this.
I haven’t had bad experiences with teenagers. I don’t consider this one a bad experience either. I understand your comments. I hurt your ego and you want to snap back. That’s ok. The comment about teenager was meant to show that you are young in this area. Albeit it was a little sarcastic. While very much entitled to your opinion, it’s not as strong as others that have been doing this kind of thing for years and years. When you come out and say that you have done 2 MB’s and 1 GPW and you have found on average that they only take 200 hours to do a restoration on; what were you expecting to happen when people read that comment? Then when you start to give more details about your restoration work and how much of it is sent off to others to do the work, it becomes clear that we are not even on the same page. You don’t need to build yourself your own business to get to the point of professionalism that Matt has reached. So many of the best examples of correct and show quality restorations come from car ports and detached home garages from ordinary people, not just the professional with all the fancy equipment and tools. These ordinary people just go the extra mile to ensure their project is perfect. Not everyone has to do it that way. To each his own. But, you just can’t come up and act like you know what you are talking about and how you have done several restorations and how it only takes you 200 hours on average.
Dave is right. If you start this early like this and really work at what you have a passion for, you will become very good at it. Go that extra mile. Add that extra 5% or more that Dave encourages you to. Don’t settle for “that’s good enough”. As Dave said, this is more than just rebuilding Jeeps.
It’s not what goes into CJ’s that take so many hours. Being a CJ has nothing to do with it really. CJ’s are actually pretty simple in comparison to all the other vehicles out there. I bet more people out there doing 40’s and 50’s model sedans wish they had some flat sides to work with! Anyway, the amount of hours that Matt put in to this project is simply a reflection of his quest for perfection in his work. When you spend the extra minute, hour day or two focusing on that one thing and not settling for “it’s good enough” the time adds up. I may not be the best person to explain all this to you since I am sure my word does not go far with you now anyways. Just take the advice Dave has given you and continue on. Be prepared for criticism if you go to shows. That’s not a pop shot at you or your work. There are guys out there that will point out flaws just because they can. Don’t get in a hurry. Be complete and thorough with your work and you’ll get there.